1 minute ago, rka said:

I really don't think the main focus of XP 12 has been the flight model.

That's indeed the problem ... "thinking" is "not knowing" 😅 (a German idiom - maybe also in English?)

4 minutes ago, uwespeed said:

Oohhh 😯 . So many complicated formulas for so little result 😆.

I'm a US CPL and someone who has used the SDK for MSFS2020.

It's pretty friggin' real to me.  This is a simulation.

To keep this on topic, what are you expecting from XP12's flight model that MSFS2020 is not capable of doing.

You may say "Aircraft X is too floaty" and "Aircraft B reaches 185 knots at 80% throttle too fast" but those are aircraft issues.

What about the aerodynamics with those "fancy formulas" do you feel is missing?  Or are you just shooting from the hip here?

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by Gulfstream

7 minutes ago, rka said:

I really don't think the main focus of XP 12 has been the flight model.

The main focus of XP12 - as for every other version of X-Plane - IS the flight model. Everything else is of secondary importance. That is what Goran was saying.

What you are saying is that the main effort exerted on the transition from XP11 to XP12 was not the flightmodel, which is correct.

The flightmodel was already extremely good in XP11, so only nuances were improved. The main effort was spent on improving the visual fidelity of X-Plane.

12 minutes ago, Gulfstream said:

I'm a US CPL and someone who has used the SDK for MSFS2020.

I really wish people would stop prefacing their posts with "I have X qualifications". There are CPL's who like MSFS.  There are CPL's who like X-Plane.  Qualifications are a moot point.  We had a CL650 pilot, who flies that aircraft for a living, who helped us with the CL650 for X-Plane, who wouldn't touch MSFS if you paid him.  Qualifications are irrelevant.  Enjoy whatever floats your boat.

12 minutes ago, Gulfstream said:

What about the flight model do you feel is missing?  Or are you just shooting from the hip here?

I can personally provide a list, if you like. 

 

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by GoranM

12 minutes ago, GoranM said:

I can personally provide a list, if you like.

Yes please. It would be very interesting. (Specifically with regards to the flight model.)

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by jarmstro

27 minutes ago, uwespeed said:

Oohhh 😯 . So many complicated formulas for so little result 😆.

Thanks for your thoughtful and contributing comments.

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by rka
Plural

12 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

Yes please. It would be very interesting. (Specifically with regards to the flight model.)

 No problem.  Here's a little taste, that I think is more than enough.  I think this thread has been derailed enough.  So please, soak this list up and come to the realization that X-Plane's flight model is quite exceptional and as close to complete as one could have at this time.  At the very least, it's the most comprehensive flight model available in a consumer level flight sim.  And dare I say it, a commercial one, too.

If you want to discuss flight models any further, open up a new thread.  Although, if it's a comparison thread, it'll likely get shut down very quickly.

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by GoranM

22 minutes ago, GoranM said:

 No problem.  Here's a little taste, that I think is more than enough.  I think this thread has been derailed enough.  So please, soak this list up and come to the realization that X-Plane's flight model is quite exceptional and as close to complete as one could have at this time.  At the very least, it's the most comprehensive flight model available in a consumer level flight sim.  And dare I say it, a commercial one, too.

If you want to discuss flight models any further, open up a new thread.  Although, if it's a comparison thread, it'll likely get shut down very quickly.

LOL!  Nice try.😀

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by jarmstro

@jarmstro, keep the discussion on topic and respectful please. This discussion relates to the A330 only.

It has been exactly 0 days since another thread was derailed.

I finally lost my faith in this "community", I swear I have seen less heated fights in PCMR community and other heavily divided groups. I am not going to name names, but it is either people who gain a huge satisfaction by calling MSFS an inaccurate "game" (they use the term "game" in a derogatory way) and downplay Asobo's work or people who gain a huge satisfaction by downplaying Laminar's by making people "admit" whatever aspect of flight simulation is more important and having a sick interest in them going out of business. If there is ONE thing these extreme X-Plane and MSFS followers agree (I know sounds impossible, right?) and be really happy about, it is likely P3D's death and its developers going out of business, which really says a lot about both sides. I always want to think that there is no way this is how the entire "community" is and that there must be a silent majority who appreciates all sides but I started to lose my faith in that too.

Sometimes I regret getting into other civilian simulators and not staying in FlightGear, at least they had a proper community.

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by BiologicalNanobot

18 hours ago, jcomm said:

I am tempted to try the VR experience that most say is "no way back", but it's so expensive 😕

Arrrgghhh!

Ya' know, if you had accepted that 2080 I offered so long ago, I would have probably had you first in mind when I gave away my Rift-s about a month or so ago... 😛

52 minutes ago, BiologicalNanobot said:

Sometimes I regret getting into other civilian simulators and not staying in FlightGear, at least they had a proper community.

I've seen just as pointless fights in the FlightGear community as I've seen in here. Not on a daily basis mind you, but enough to lose all willingness to get involved in the overall project.

1 minute ago, Bjoern said:

I've seen just as pointless fights in the FlightGear community as I've seen in here. Not on a daily basis mind you, but enough to lose all willingness to get involved in the overall project.

Well yeah, but at least it is not in a daily basis there. While here every single word not allowed thread is being locked and derailed. It has been almost 2 years since MSFS was released and the drama is still going. I just hope FlightGear and its new HDR pipeline draws more developers into the platform.

This is getting more and more absurd IMO. "Don't mention the war" level.

3 hours ago, GoranM said:

If you want to discuss flight models any further, open up a new thread.  Although, if it's a comparison thread, it'll likely get shut down very quickly.

Aka an incomplete list of planes only xplane can define an accurate flight model for.

For something like the A330 I guess the important ones are:

more than one rudder

weight shift

speedbrakes

characteristics that vary with speed. - That one is fairly surprising... No FlyByWire... huh.

Edited January 19, 20224 yr by mSparks