>Not that I don't believe you, but where did you pull that 561>people figure from?>>-Greg>(Curious)FP shows you details for each file you download from FP. I checked the details for the first beta file which had 561 downloads. If all 561 are unique clicks or multiple clicks from the same user I don't know.

Aah - question answered. Thanks guys!

>Rather, they have shown a>significant lack of regard for many of the simmers who have>supported the franchise over several generations of new>product. A really sad situation. One can only hope that they>have learned a bit from the experience and that the mistakes>won't be repeated.>>DougI don't understand. How has the fileplanet beta hurt you, the loyal flight sim customer?

>The posts I've seen over the last few days relating to the>Fileplanet FSX beta indicate to me that its largely a fun fest>for a select few (paying) FS fans a month out from the full>release. Its value as a beta seems questionable given how>unstructured user feedback to MS seems to be (please correct>me I am wrong here), and moreso because any bug found would>have to major and easy to fix to meet the very short time line>before FSX goes gold. The NDA side of things seems to be a>non-issue, given the information being disclosed on these>forums without any apparent recourse from AVSIM or MS.>>Before anyone points out that I could have signed up for>Fileplanet and the FSX beta, sure I could be rubbing shoulders>with the lucky ones, but I'd still be left wondering what MS>aims for this beta to achieve. Comments anyone?>>GaryThe point- viral marketing. buzz. hype. A recipe for higher sales-- Microsoft has used this method (think XBox) successfully in the recent past so I'd guess they're utilizing the same winning methods. They're also doing this with Vista.Indeed, I respect the strategy.

I was wrong nevermind...

Personally, it hasn't hurt me at all as I chose from the beginning not to participate in this "beta" test. But it is obvious, however that there are others who, based on the expectations fostered by the MS team, did join FilePlanet for the sole purpose of participating in the "beta" and have not, for whatever reason, had that opportunity. Whether or not the wording as to whom may, or may not, be "chosen" was clear and satisfactory I cannot say as I didn't "join". But the fact remains that it was solely due to the impetus provided by MS that many chose to look to FilePlanet in the first place. In my view, this whole affair has been very poorly handled and I repeat my hopes for the future that next time a full-version demo is offered, if there a next time, there will be something provided to the community other than limited availability to a pay-for-access site. Doug

>>Rather, they have shown a>>significant lack of regard for many of the simmers who have>>supported the franchise over several generations of new>>product. A really sad situation. One can only hope that they>>have learned a bit from the experience and that the mistakes>>won't be repeated.>>>>Doug>>I don't understand. How has the fileplanet beta hurt you, the>loyal flight sim customer?It has hurt me $24.94 (19.95 Gamespy Founders Club subscription including Fileplanet + $4.99 local tax). A subscription purchased at the express recommandation of an ACES spokesman in this forum:"My comment is that I recommend you all sign up...soon."Tdragger - August 4thhttp://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...id=12252&page=3Now - I DO believe that this was said in good faith. And the decision to subscribe/buy a ticket in the lottery was mine and mine alone.But the subsequent train of events raise a few questions, some of which I've asked Fileplanet support:"Re: Microsoft Flight Simulator X Beta.On August 6th I purchased a Founders Club Subscription and signed up for this Beta.I have not received neither confirmation of participation nor a message that I have not been selected.Login at the email authentication page gives invalid email error message though email address is valid - no key is found in my account. (While the key for another subscriber beta is shown. I joined this beta for testing purposes only).From the many threads regarding this beta in the FSX forum of AVSIM (Major FS site)http://www.avsim.com/it seems clear that all beta slots have been filled and no further participation is possible.Can you confirm that this is the case?If so- did you register my sign-up? - is it true that less than 600 slots have been assigned for this Beta?- was participation selection based on a first come - first served principle?- who had final say in selection of participants - Fileplanet or ACES/Microsoft?"and will keep you posted if I get more than the same canned answer that has alredy been quoted in another thread os this subject.Lars

Chandler,I'd never heard of viral marketing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viral_marketing) before, but it quite closely lines up with what we have been seeing with the FSX beta. Maybe it should have been caused the FSX virus instead ;)Gsry

I agree that the FilePlanet beta could have been handled better, but this was a first time for us, too. However in the future I'd expect more of this sort of this thing as we broaden the definition of the "Flight Simulator community". We certainly value the support we've gotten from customers like those who post here and on other FS sites. But the future of our business depends on us becoming more inclusive, not exclusive.

I'm sorry if you feel misled, Lars, but I don't feel like we made any attempt to mislead on purpose. We were trying to respond to a long time request from the community--the ability to provide input to the evolution of the product. As I stated on my blog, we chose FilePlanet because they have the capacity to administer a large scale program. We do not. As for your questions, all Microsoft did was arrange for FilePlanet to host the beta--everything else was up to them. Certainly if we ask them to host future releases we'll work to make sure the process goes more smoothly.

>The point of the beta is to entice enough people to try the>multiplayer, to find out if the GameSpy infrastructure is>ready for the game's release.Well, that and the diagnostic reports that users should always send whenever the inevitable problem(s) arise......far too many people don't seem to grasp the idea that those reports do make a difference in the final analysis. They are fed into a gigantic database, collated, sorted and eventually spit out specific lines of code in the core engine that are possible problems... ;)

I clearly remember the Beta signup page saying Subscription Doesn't Guarantee Participation. As a result I didn't sign up ;). End of story :)

Anyone with a subscription can download the beta, albeit with a time limit. Check out the other thread.

Thanks for posting here Tdragger. I was one of those who subscribed to FP solely for the opportunity to participate in the FSX beta and was not selected. While disappointed I fully understood there were no guarantees. Many of us in the user community are also learning right along with Microsoft as to how new open policy works. Trust me that most sim enthusiasts are loving it and please don't ever go back to the closed doors of the past. I expect with the lessons learned that the FS11 public beta and demo release schedules will flow much more smoothly. I also can't help but wonder if all the flamers on the FSX forums are the same people who were decrying a year ago that MSFS is dead and that there would never be an FSX.Phil.

Thank you for answering - unlike Fileplanet which after more than 30 hours have not bothered.I do agree with you that everybody will benefit by extending the userbase of FS - and using Fileplanet/Gamespy as well as Gamespot (to launch the demo) seems to work.After all on Fileplanet the demo has reached number 33 of the most downloaded demos in the last 7 days with more than 25.000 downloads.Gamespot reports more than 140.000 downloads.And in fact the very reasons you mentioned for providing the beta, were instrumental in my decision to subscribe. Ah h*** - lets be honest, curiosity, bragging rights (over my brother and some friends) also went into the equation;-)But the conduct of Fileplanet/Gamespy/IGN seems peculiar at best: - keeping the sign up webpage for the beta open long after keys were allegedly sent out and access to the beta closed- being unavailable to their paying customers i.e. not answering support requests or questions except by a canned response with an ambiguous wording (*full text at the end of this post)- providing direct links to the beta download page from both Gamespy and IGN (though not from Fileplanet) in direct contradiction to the answer I was given - that closed beta downloads would be marked as closed. I am fully aware that I'm threading on dangerous ground here - I have no wish to see the download closed. In fact quite the opposite ...;)And YES I've got it :D - I DO enjoy it for all of the 30 minutes any flight lasts. BUT ;( The number of Beta downloads (full 8.4 GB) have grown from 1661 to 2182 over the last 24 hours - and all from paying customers.Some may have downloaded more than once (as some threads on install problems indicate).Perhaps ACES could engage in a constructive dialogue (if not an open and frank exchange of views :-bat ) with Fileplanet to get the keys necessary to activate the beta delivered to those who were left behind. After all anybody who has been able to get it, has been a fully paid up "member"..Would we be difficult to identify - perhaps, I do not know ...What I do know is that some of us are the people who have downloaded the beta and have no key to activate it listed in our Fileplanet accounts. And this can be verified ...We can't be that many - of course depending on how many were admitted in the first place. If the "closed" beta is scheduled to be opened to all registered users of Fileplanet (as seems the case in many Fileplanet betas) - well and good. This could be brought forward ..If not - than at least a response to those who have (tried to) contact Fileplanet support regarding this issue (including a valid key) could be a solution.I do not - generally - put any faith in conspiracy theories of history. In my experience Oops..(what happened here :-hmmm) theories are far more likely to reflect actual events.A more uncharitable mind could perhaps construct a scenario of viral marketing gone awry - but I still feel that your recommendation for all to sign up was made in good faith.And come october we'll all have left this little episode behind us. And the grumbling and whineing over low FPS on a P2 400, with 128 MB RAM and the latest 3Dfx card will really take off in the forums :-vuur Lars * Fileplanet "support" canned response:"Thank you for contacting FilePlanet support!We would like to offer the following suggestions based on the subject of your ticket request:All currently available betas are listed on FilePlanet's front page. If a beta is not seen there, it is most likely closed to due keys exhuasted or the beta has ended. The word [CLOSED] will be on the page demoting it is closed if you should find an old file download.Please note some restrictions apply. Some betas may be regulated and limited by age or country location. FilePlanet does not determine this and cannot open the beta to you outside of these restrictions.Keys are limited and once they run out the sign up period is over.If you are looking for a copy of your key, this can be found on your Beta Keys Archive page: http://www.fileplanet.com/betas/keydisplay.aspxIf you are having trouble signing up for a beta due to page errors, please close all browser windows and reopen only one. Make sure your browser is not blocking cookies, java and the pop up blocker is off.If you are attempting to register an account on a beta site using a key you received from FilePlanet and that site is not allowing you to register or is giving you errors you must contact that specific site.FilePlanet hands out the key, FilePlanet is not associated to nor does it have any connection to the beta site and it's registration. The keys are given to us to pass out by the developer. We would love to help but are not who runs the site you are receiving errors from.If these suggestions have not helped or your issue is not covered here, please update this ticket by visiting the link below and a support agent will assist you.Thank you!"